Can You Take It François Gautier?

Very poor (perhaps willful feigning of factual incorrectness to push forward WRONG opinions) performance by Madhu Trehan. The bit about just assigning the entire responsibility for communal riots on political parties (be it BJP in 2002-Gujarat or Congress in 1969-Ahmedabad/1983-Nellie/1984-Delhi/1987-Hashimpura/1989-Bhagalpur/1992-Bombay/1993-Surat/2012-Assam), and absolving the ordinary people who willfully join violent mobs to indulge in street massacres, is factually wrong and disingenuous. Some more point-wise comments:

Madhu Trehan: “Don’t you think that by becoming militant, we (Hindus/Indians) are reducing ourselves to the level of the Islamofascists terrorists and/or violent western/European colonialists?”

Comment: NO. Did Madhu even hear what Francois Gautier tells her in the interview? He explicitly said that it is alright (he invoked an example from the Bhagavad Gita) to become militant or violent to DEFEND yourself. He explicitly explained how the current situation demands the self-defense of Dharma (truth / culture / heritage / society, or what Francois calls as “ancient knowledge”). This is NOT ANALOGOUS to Islamic terrorism or western/European colonialism that were and are implicitly OFFENSIVE in nature.

Francois Gautier: “This passive, tolerant, liberal, secular, peaceful and accommodating behaviour of extending a hand of friendship in spite of repeated betrayals and explicit bad intentions of your enemy is a typical aspect of Hinduness.” (By “Hinduness” here, Francois quite clearly means Sanatan Dharma (or possibly Bharatiyata, as he himself used the term “Indian-ness” as a synonym once during the interview), or the Indian ethos and “way of life”, instead of the narrow western definition of “Hinduism” that limits itself to theistic religious worship of a God in the person of Vishnu and Shiva.)

Madhu Trehan: “No, there is nothing Hindu about it, it is a political stand.”

Comment: Madhu is WRONG again. Tell me ONE other nation in the world that has been so accommodating and forgiving towards its outright ENEMIES than what India has been (right from the times of the Mahajanapadas, to the times of Prithviraj Chauhan, to present-day India vis-a-vis Pakistan)? Also, tell me, would India have been an equally peaceful, relaxed, accommodating and tolerant society, if the underpinnings of our society were based upon anything other than Sanatan Dharma? BE HONEST and tell me, would we have been even just a secular country, had we been 80% Muslim instead of 80% “Hindu”? BE HONEST and tell me, would we have been a peaceful non-imperialistic country that never attacked/invaded/colonized any other nation ever, had we been 80% Christian instead of 80% “Hindu”? So it is a FACT that we are a passive, tolerant, liberal, secular, peaceful and accommodating nation PRECISELY and ONLY because our society is almost entirely based upon Indian-ness (Bharatiyata, or Sanatan Dharma, whatever you may wish to call it). (After all, even the Muslim or Christian minorities of India were “Hindus” till a few generations back, and hence carry essentially the same cultural ethos — no wonder the “Indianized” form of Islam, Sufism, is more liberal and relaxed than the other sects in the Islamic world.)

Madhu Trehan: “If Narendra Modi is such a great and efficient leader, then why didn’t he catch the Godhra train-burning perpetrators within 24 hours and hang them in public within 48 hours instead of allowing riots to occur for 2-3 days?”

Comment: This is an utterly nonsensical and profoundly naive argument, that Madhu had also made to Arun Shourie. It is SHOCKING that someone with 30 years journalism experience could make such a ridiculous non-argument. The suggestion of “instant justice” is in itself immature (as also unrealistic). We have, thankfully, a good justice system in this country where “summary trials” and “next-day executions” do not (and cannot) occur. In any case, is Madhu seriously suggesting that the conspirators of the mob that burnt down the Sabarmati express would not have denied their role (or alleged an “accident” inside the carriage, as the Congress/UPA and Laloo Yadav later did try to propagandize) and avoided the law by hook or by crook? Look no further than Ajmal Kasab — the 26/11 attacks with 300 fatalities were equally dastardly and devastating as the burning alive of 60 pilgrims returning from Ayodhya, and we also had CCTV evidence, audio transcripts of satellite phone conversations between terrorists and their masterminds in Karachi, 100s of items of irrefutable documentary proofs and a solid case against him, and YET the justice system of this country could hang him only after 4 years (yes, that is FOUR LONG YEARS)! Then what is she talking about Modi being able to hang the Godhra conspirators “publicly” (which would have been illegal, by the way) in a matter of 48 hours?! Also, like Francois already told to her before the question, that region has had a long history of communal tensions and TWO-SIDED riots. But even if that was any other part of India, it is highly unlikely that a provocation as blatant and flagrant as the Sabarmati burning would have gone unnoticed or without retaliation. Yes, communal riots are huge tragedies and societal screw-ups, yes yes yes, but one CANNOT just close one’s eyes and assume they do not exist or wish them away.

Madhu Trehan: “… planned riots in Gujarat in 2002 when innocent Muslims were killed …” (… same old baseless lies and factually incorrect propaganda …)

Comment:
(Fact 1.) The 2002 communal violence in Gujarat was one of the SMALLEST ever communal riots in independent India’s history. 1984 Delhi, 1983 Nellie, 1989 Bhagalpur, 1987 Hashimpura, 1969 Ahmedabad, 1992 Mumbai, 1993 Surat, 2012 Assam, etc, were all much LARGER riots in terms of people killed as well as those displaced. Yes yes yes, even one death is a death too many, yes yes yes, but like I said above, communal tensions do exist and riots do occur all over the WORLD and probably more so in India. Therefore, THIS DEBATE NEEDS TO BE OBJECTIVE AND BASED ON HARD FACTS, AND NOT WISHY-WASHY SUBJECTIVE NONSENSE BASED ON PREJUDICED OPINIONS.

(Fact 2.) The Gujarat riots were TWO-SIDED riots. It is NOT that “only innocent Muslims” got killed. A huge number of “innocent Hindus” were also killed, why does nobody talk about them?! Why is everybody always only ever feeding the same old false victimhood complex among Indian Muslims, with baseless allegations of “govt-orchestrated planned riots” and Tehelka-propagandized outright false stories of “disembowelment of pregnant women” THAT NEVER EVEN HAPPENED in reality (as per SC-monitored SIT report)?! Why don’t you give hard documentary evidence for your fake sob stories for a change?!

(Fact 3.) It is FALSE PROPAGANDA that “thousands of Muslims” were killed by “goons affiliated to Gujarat govt or BJP”. After coming to power, the Congress/UPA govt set up multiple judicial commissions and enquiries on the post-Godhra 2002 Gujarat riots. As per the Congress/UPA govt’s own statement in parliament, the post-Godhra communal riots led to the deaths of ~800 Muslims and ~250 Hindus. (The latter number does not even include the 60-odd Hindu pilgrims (of whom 40 were women and children) returning from Ayodhya who were burnt alive in the S-6 coach of the Sabarmati Express at Signal Falia in Godhra, the mass-murder incident that led to the post-Godhra riots.) Is the number “800″ fit to be called “thousands”? Is this not purposeful and mischievous exaggeration? Are two-sided “riots” in which 800 Muslims and 250 Hindus die worthy of being called “pogroms” or a “genocide”? Can the latter terms be applied to every single act of widespread violence? Does the media even know the difference between two-sided “riots” and one-sided “genocide”? Or are they purposefully blatantly lying and spreading mischievous misinformation propaganda?

(Fact 4.) Nearly ~200 of the respondents against whom FIRs relating both to the Godhra massacre and the post-Godhra communal riots have been filed, are Congress politicians. Nearly 25 Congress politicians and workers have already been convicted for their crimes by the courts. Congress politicians totally dominate the list of convicted masterminds of the Godhra train burning incident. Mehmud Hussain Kalota was the convener of the Congress Panchmahal district minority cell and president of the Godhra municipal corporation. Salim Abdul Ghaffar Sheikh was the president of the Youth Congress Panchmahal district. Farroukh Bhana was secretary of the Congress Panchmahal district committee. Abdul Rehman Abdul Majid Ghantia and Haji Bilal were known Congress workers. These are all CONVICTED criminals who did the Godhra Sabarmati Express massacre. Even in the post-Godhra communal riots, Congress politicians participated from both Muslim and Hindu sides to mass-murder the opposite community. Ahmedabad Mayor Himmatsinh Patel was a Congressman. Baroda MLA Mehrsinh Chaudhry was a Congressman. Baroda Deputy Mayor Nissar Bapu was a Congressman. And these Congress politicians were leading different mobs from different sides throughout the nights for street massacres and mass-murdering Hindus as well as Muslims. There are pending FIRs and cases against all of them. But why is the entire media hung up solely on Narendra Modi and the BJP/RSS?

(Fact 5.) The case against Narendra Modi is totally false and politically motivated. Teesta Setalvad and her husband Javed Anand have shamelessly accepted in multiple interviews that they get crores of rupees worth of funding from the Congress and the CPM, as well as from dubious foreign agencies. Sanjiv Bhatt and Manoj Mitta (TOI journalist) ghostwrite affidavits for other “witnesses” under the guidance of Teesta and Javed, and all of them are in the dock now on charges of perjury, something even noted by the COURTS. Narendra Modi, on the other hand, has come out unscathed, after the Justices Nanavati-Mehta judicial commission enquiries as well as the SC-appointed SC-monitored CBI Special Investigation Team reports completely exonerated him of any wrongdoing whatsoever. The “failing to rein in the riots quickly” charge against Modi is also without substance. The army was called in within 2 days, and got deployed by the 3rd day in most districts of the state. Police and paramilitary help was sought (but not received) from the neighbouring states of Rajasthan, MP and Maharashtra too, all three of which were under Congress govts in 2002. If anything, Modi did a terrific job in containing such a widespread outbreak of violence in a large state like Gujarat that has seen many communal riots since independence. But the 2002 riots are the only riots to be overhyped, both to attack Modi and the BJP, as well as to sweep the Congress’ own massive riots (1984 Delhi, 1983 Nellie, 1989 Bhagalpur, 1987 Hashimpura, 1969 Ahmedabad, 1992 Mumbai, 1993 Surat, 2012 Assam, etc) that were even bigger in scale and casualties, and raged on for weeks and months, under the carpet. It is a testimony to the Gujarat govt’s prompt actions that the 2002 riots were contained quickly and were therefore less destructive than many others in the history of modern India.

Madhu Trehan: “K. P. S. Gill and the Indian State resorted to subverting human rights and doing police encounters to firmly put down the separatist insurgency and terrorism in Punjab in the 80s. (Something similar had to be done in Kashmir in the 90s.) But how can you compare this with the 2002 Gujarat riots?”

Comment: This is a false charge. Like he mentioned, Francois was comparing police encounters in Punjab, Kashmir or Maharashtra (as a means of firmly putting down terrorism) with similar police encounters in Gujarat (specifically Sohrabuddin Sheikh and Tulsi Prajapati, the famous underworld criminals linked to Dawood Ibrahim, and also to the Lashkar-e-Taiba and the Pakistani ISI). Madhu should have immediately apologized to Francois for misquoting his article — simultaneously, she should fire whoever (some junior NL staffer may be) gave her those talking points and cheatsheets about Francois’ articles.

Francois Gautier: “If I am a man and my wife and children are roasted alive and brutally murdered in a violent mob action by a community with whom I have several years of social and communal tension, then even I may have taken to the streets in violent retaliation.”

Comment: This is a perfectly UNDERSTANDABLE analysis of what happens in communal riots. (Note, I said, “understandable” and NOT “desirable”.) Francois is only analyzing why and how riots happen. Like a popular Kamal Hassan movie (“Hey Ram”) about the 14 August 1946 Direct Action Day riots, when a man loses his entire family (wife, children, other relatives) in a day, it is NATURAL that he may lose his sense of morality or personal safety, and become obsessed with an overbearing desire for vengeance and retribution. It is then that one decides to take the law in one’s own hands and vent out his anger on whoever he finds to be a representative of the evil that consumed his own family and life. This is NOT how things SHOULD be, but we live in a practical and REAL WORLD, and this is how things ARE, whether we like it or not. That, and only that, was Francois Gautier’s point, which was completely missed by Madhu Trehan.

Francois Gautier: “I speak the truth. If that makes you call me a fundamentalist, then so be it.”
Comment: Touche!

PS: Finally, one needs to understand and internalize, once and for all, that politics and society (any social construct, be it culture or community) are INSEPARABLE. I was particularly pained to see Madhu Trehan making the same ridiculous and nonsensical non-argument about Godhra (“Modi should have caught and publicly hung the perpetrators the very next day to prevent public rioting”, that she also made to Shourie) here to Francois. I often think that these comment sections are provided by NL just for readers to chat among themselves, while the holy exalted editors and authors can continue to remain ensconced in their ivory towers and persist with their one-way top-down opinionated agenda.

That was a BRILLIANT point that Francois Gautier made.